cfauvel

Very cool.... you did exactly what I did to get it idling right...bravo.

what IS your primary language?

What I like about forums and youtube...you get to interact with EVERYONE around the world. It really makes me see that  we are all really doing the same things.

We play music, we make music, we play with boats, we play with ATVs....all over the world.

On 12/17/2020 at 3:50 PM, Kuba said:

I hope it will be 😁😁. If not I’m going to look for rebuild kit with it . 

If it’s not a problem what rebuild  kit did you used?

I looked but can't find where I bought it from ...but found the package 
Moose Racing part # 1003-0555

I think I bought it JUST for the brass doohicky to hold the throttle cable...but since I had a brand new carb there was nothing I needed from it

ugh ...I don't remember anymore...

I'm not sure what you mean.
if you mean the little brass needle looking thing...yeah I think it was included ...should be a pic of it in the ebay listing. I believe it came with a new black threaded  plastic retainer too.

The way it works is opposite of a choke really. When full "choke" the needle is pulled away from the orifice which in turn would allow more gas to be sucked in. Then when the "choke" is released the needle is fully seated in the orifice, thus the primary circuit being used to suck in the gas.

Actually I think I had to buy a rebuild kit that included that needle and the little brass gizmo that holds the throttle cable.

3 hours ago, Kuba said:

Hi , I new with ATV , I just bought a 2001 quad master 500 with aftermarket carb , but previous owner messed up something, drilled extra holes , not attached choke cable  etc .  

 I’m looking for another aftermarket carburetor , do you remember which brand you’re go with . I seen so many on eBay or Amazon , similar prices , not sure is any difference between them . If you remember from where you got it please share this info . 

Thanks.  

here is the one I bought from ebay

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carburetor-for-Suzuki-Quad-Master-500-QuadMaster-500-LTA500F-2000-2001/362566375168?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Hopefully you don't have to mill out the port where the throttle cable goes.

Would be nice to be able to edit one's [previous posts....the values highlighted in yellow above were NOT achieved by either regulator...only the .4-.7 values were seen.
The new regulator stays cooler when the ATV is warmed up and doesn't sporadically miss.

I say this has been resolved.

New regulator Diode test results

it appears the model Y and K1 represent the years...apparently I'm working on a 2000 atv not 2001 like I thought

found an online vin decode page (not automatic)...

 https://www.suzukiatvforums.com/threads/identifying-your-vin.5662/

my vin comes out to 

J - japan
S - suzuki
A - atv
A - ATV
M - 400-499cc
4 - 4 stroke
2 - design sequence 2
A - design sequence A  "123456789ABCDEF...." - this is the 10th design sequence letter of A
0 - check digit
y - model year  2000(Y), 2001(1) (or K1)
2 - factory code
107100 - serial number

I accidentally bought the correct regulator

found an online vin decode page (not automatic)...but it appears I have a year 2000 quadmaster not 2001
https://www.suzukiatvforums.com/threads/identifying-your-vin.5662/

my vin comes out to 
J - japan
S - suzuki
A - atv
A - ATV
M - 400-499cc
4 - 4 stroke
2 - design sequence 2
A - design sequence A  "123456789ABCDEF...." - this is the 10 design sequence letter of A
0 - check digit
y - model year  2000(Y), 2001(1) (or K1)
2 - factory code
107100 - serial number

this is the parts diagram...would be nice if there were something more as to what is Model Y and Model K1

I did get the following from an ebay seller
32800-44D21 is 1362912516503 **ASU6022 is for years 1998 to 2001**
32800-44D31 is 362868291780 **ASU6023 is for different models and years 2000-2005**

I went with the 21 as it IS a quadmaster...

"Is there a part number anywhere on yours to cross reference?" - well the one on there is actually a replacement from 2018 and it failed so not sure if that is the right one...I'll check tomorrow. I don't have the one from 2001

there are two part numbers that come up for the voltage regulator

32800-44D21 model Y
32800-44D31 model K1

I don't know which one to get .
how do I know what model the ATV is?

looking at the parts layout...I don't see the pickup coil being separate from the stator, which is a bummer..... I'd like to replace the pickup coil stuff as it is a little off from spec...but since it runs so well slightly warm I think I will skip it.

The parts diagram lists two regulators model Y and model K1, not sure which is right for my application.

woohoo Update:

Test results

Ignition Coil
resistance
primary spec 0.1 - 0.8                                                 actual -> 0.000 ohm
secondary spec 10 - 15 kOhms                                   actual 17.x kohms  (not quite in spec)
cranking volts spec > 140v                                          actual >160+

Pickups and power source coils

voltage
pickup coil  spec > 0.5v                                                 actual = blue/green = 6.x+v
powersource coil spec  >0.7 v                                        actual - yellow/white = 0.5v - 0.6v  (not quite in spec)

resistance 
pickup spec 170-250 ohms                                            actual 234 ohms blue/green
powersource spec .05 - .5 ohm                                       actual  0.0 - 0.1 ohms white/yellow

Stator 

no load Voltage test (3 yellow wire at voltage regulator)
multimeter set to AC and engine running at 5000 rpm 

pin A to pin b, and pin A to pin C, and pin B to Pin c

Spec +60v                                                                Actual 69+ volts

Diode test...

.I screwed that up (just notice the multimeter is supposed to be set to Diode, going to re-test that for confirmation whilst cold and whilst hot)

The fact that the manual says to test the No Load Voltage (the three yellow wire connector at voltage regulator) whilst the motor is running and coupler disconnected I knew I could mess with that connector whilst it was running

waited 10+ minutes at idle and a bit off idle until I heard the motor missing...disconnected the 3 yellow wire coupler and it instantly got better ....plugged it back in...then a couple minutes it started missing again....and again unplugged the coupler and it got better instantly.

THE FIX - I am 99% sure it is the regulator though it is only 2 years old.

BTW I HATE how everything is buried...have to remove the gas tank to get to coil?! 

Thank you so much for the detailed reply..

What you described is extremely similar to my 2cycle 225hp Evinrude.....so now I'm getting it...

on the johnson/evinrude too the magnets on the flywheel would either fly off (they were glued on) or slide towards each other, thus the voltage created by the stator would not be correct for the CDI/powerpack. When the magnets slid together the symptom would be lower than expected rpms and boat wouldn't get on plane....didn't miss per se, but no umpf

the flywheel is behind the pull start right?

Thanks again for the explanation...really helps

Chris

PS: I don't think the magnets are the issue as when the motor is warming up it runs great and fast....I suspect some thermal related issue....either CDI or coil.
Would the voltage regulator/rectifier come into play in the ignition? on my boat the regulator provides 14v to the battery, provides 12 v for the variou accessories and the tach puls for the tachometer....so I COULD remove the regulator and the motor would start...it would burn up the stator, but it would run.

took a ride and played with gas cap when it started acting up...don't think it is the cap or lack of gas

when it started happening I took the gas cap of and nothing changed

I changed the petcock to PRI and RES and nothing happened differently

then out of the blue it was fine for a bit, then happened again.

The video below shows that it doesn't appear to be the gas cap
 

Could it be the coil? 

Do you know the ignition system on this thing? What tells the coil to fire?
Starting with the stator/magneto wires must be going to the voltage regulator to produce the 14v+ to the battery, as well some wires must be going somewhere to provide 100-200v to something that has capacitors (like a boat's powerpack), then something to trigger that to send the volts to the coil that ups the volts to something like 20-40Kv that goes to plug....right?

Again I don't know this machine very well, so no clue what triggers the timing of the spark....I don't think the coil itself would know when to trigger, so a bit in the dark.

 

oooh found the ignition system for the quadmaster...it HAS a powerpack thingy...now where is it? 🙂

 

oh sh** I think you nailed it.
"Or maybe a plugged fuel cap vent causing vaccum lock on the tank?"

I DID open the gas cap when it started missing then moved the petcock to PRI then back to ON.....

Thank you!! going to get a new cap...once I do one more test.
 

So I've had my bro-in-law's 4 wheeler to get it running again. 
Ended up buying a new aftermarket carb, cleaning fuel tank, cleaning petcock and it works near perfectly .

put the petcock to PRI for about 5 seconds , turn it back to on, pull full enrichener , start it  up (starts right up), slowly release the enrichener and put it in gear and go up down the road. Slow, fast, idle etc all good

BUT then out of the blue it will start missing badly (by this time the motor is hot), to the point I can't move the ATV.

Then out of the blue, maybe 30 seconds later, it is back to normal and I can go up and down the road for testing just fine.

I'm trying to get the ATV in tiptop shape to return to him, but bugged by this miss, I'm sure this machine will come back to me if it keeps missing...

Thanks in advance

BTW I am mechanically inclined, but not an expert on this atv...

UPDATE: ATV came back to me from bro-in-law.
This time it wouldn't start, like nothing at all.

3 things - bad battery, bad key switch and cracked exhaust pipe at head...the internals of the key switch was all kinds of nasty...using a multi-meter set to continuity/sound found that the key switch was bad.

Got that sorted, then smelled the gas in the tank and it was rank, so got rid of that, which prompted me to inspect the pet-cock and carb.
The pet-cock had nasty varnish on the plastic filters, but that crap didn't get into the internals of the pet-cock...but the carb's internals had nasty varnish and obvious signs of water intrusion....this time I went with a new aftermarket carb. For 45$ I was happy with the price

Two things with the carb though....

1 - the screw to drain the bowl is on the wrong side (should be on the right side, but is on the left side where the exhaust pipe is)
2 - the area where the throttle cable goes was threaded...on the original it is not threaded and it is hollowed out so that the throttle cable's metal sheath end fits into it with an o-ring around the sheath.
      had to mill out the threads and enlarge a bit so sheath end would fit , and mill a slightly wider recessed inner lip for the o-ring to sit in. I looked for a new throttle cable that had a threaded sheath end and couldn't find one for this ATV. No worries as it is NOW nearly identical to the original carb

Put everything back together with fresh non-ethanol fuel, and it started right up with the 'enricher' on fully engaged (as expected) and initially would only idle and rev up without dying with a 'whomp' with the enricher in full activation.

yesterday spent some time adjusting the carb's pilot screw (idle mixture) (as previously done in 2018), until I got it to idle well and NOT die with the enricher NO LONGER fully engaged. I have no clue how many turns out from seated the idle mixture screw is set to (AND I DON'T CARE!, I'm not taking the carb out again to find out), but seems to start easily and runs as intended.

🙂

FYI, as far as idle speed, since this has the CVT auto trans, if you adjust the Idle Speed too much (the cable with black sheath and screw/knob that points out the right side) the CVT will catch (you'll hear it), and you won't be able to shift the gears to N, R, H, L...so just adjust the speed until the CVT belt no longer catches and that is usually the right idle speed...I'll see if I can get my inductive rpm gauge attached to verify...but at this point it runs and acts properly

24 minutes ago, davefrombc said:

Glad you  got it  sorted out.  I'll  have  to  remember to  get  people  to  check  the  voltage regulator  next time  I  try  to  help  someone with what  sounds for all  the world to  be  a carburetion problem  that  they  cabn't sort out .... And  to  not  assume  they   have all  the air filtration elements  installed since the  trouble   with at  least one other  system   seems to  have stemmed from them  leaving out  one filtration  element that  was  factory installed..  We all  learn  new things all  the time ..  Problem  for  us  older  ones  is remembering what  we  learned.

And get this weirdness...

with the original OEM regulator (but burnt), had hard starting.
with the first new reg (before burnt) no hard starting

with the first reg (after burnt) no hard starting

with the first reg NOT connected, no hard starting

with second reg (not burnt) connected, no hard starting

with third reg (not burnt) connected, no hard starting

I wouldn't think a regulator would come into play with the engine running or starting, BUT as soon as I replaced the first OEM reg, bamm started fine.

I could have been seeing anecdotal/coincidental things, and just BE carburetor cleaning up itself. 

maybe next time have the guys simply disconnect regulator when diagnosing hard start scenario as a last ditch.

Well got a new one, from a completely different seller...the fins are bigger and the depth of the fins were more than original requiring longer bolts.

Started the motor and waited about a minute, with my thermo got about 90+ degrees.

went up and down the street at a good clip and re-took the reading and got around 100 degrees....I think I am good to go now. I'll try it several times this week before returning to my bro-in-law.

and the the other seller is refunding my money.....wow

Well I posted the question to the aftermarket seller of the part, and they replied that though the description states it IS for the ATV in question ; it is in fact NOT the right part.   So taking it off and sending it back, they'll refund me and pay for shipping...

on the hunt for a new one.

52 minutes ago, davefrombc said:

Doesn't sound  right to me . I wonder if there is a fault in the  stator  that  is making it  produce  much  higher  voltages  than  normal. Something is  making the regulator sink  a  lot  more  power than it's designed for.  Foolish  question , but  is the battery  installed right way  around? I  can't see   ignition  working  if  it  is  backwards,  but stranger things  happen  sometimes .

 

 

 

well that battery is hooked up right.

I'll price out a new stator, just in case and if cheap enough go ahead and replace it.

seems awfully coincidental that the OEM fried, the first after market fried and now the second after market is really hot.

25 minutes ago, Ajmboy said:

Isn't this voltage too high?

Well I don't think so ...attached are the relevant pages from the service manual.....

the V from the stator is stated to be 60+ at 5000 rpm....and I'm getting that

I didn't do the tests for regulator/rectifier  (the grid), confused on that one really...but I'll try.

Ok guys...got the new regulator today and am a bit worried.

At idle /cold start, using a infrared therm sensor the reg jumped to 130 degrees  F in time at all.

Went down the culdesac and took reading again and it was nearing 170 degrees F...

I don't think that is good.

thoughts?

Ok...at idle the AC voltage is as follows (the three yellow wires)

Outside to outside = 30+

outside to middle = 30+

other outside to middle = 30+

at some unknown RPM where the throttle is half way down (don't have a tach)

outside to outside = 70+ volts

Outside to middle = 65V

other outside to middle = 65V

I think the stator is actually ok.

oh and I tested the ground on the plug that had two black wires and two red wires, 

with probe on each black wire to ground, they both shown continuity..did it to the frame as well as battery ground wire.

Got an offer from the ebay seller to refund me the cost of the original as may have been defective...we'll see.