90s Kawasaki bayou 220 have to cover intake to start

[Daniel Gibson]

Working on a bayou 220 that has been ran extremely hard it's whole life. Literally had almost an inch thick dirt/oil covering the motor. Yeah that bad. Surprisingly it runs though. I cleaned the carb and tank multiple times. They're clean enough to eat off of. Readjusted valve lash and set timing. Was about 3 teeth off. It cranks good and runs good only problem is I have to cover the carb intake basically choking the hell out of it for it to start. The com choke works fine. It does this each time I start it regardless of temperature both ambient or motor. Wth? Compression is at 115psi I get 130s if I put a little oil in the piston chamber. Please help. Thanks 

[Frank Angerano]

Have you checked the fuel flow from the tank ? Petcock valve and screen assembly?

[Daniel Gibson]

Yes and it seems to be good. Got it to run a little bit yesterday and was adjusting the carb and it died. Now it won't do anything but crank. Getting fuel,spark,air but my compression went from 115 down to around 90. What gives?!?

[Frank Angerano]

Take a compression reading holding the throttle wide open and then closed.  Or rip the carb off and take a reding holding your hand over the intake manifold and one without your hand over it. 
Im sure you did a great job rebuilding the carb but something is not clear inside one of the small ports within the carb.  
There is a fuel blockage someplace, a jet that’s not clear or the float is set to high.  

If you are having a rough time with the air/fuel screw then throw a rebuild kit in the carb. Ex caliber makes a great oem type kit that comes with the air fuel screw as well.  


 

 

[Daniel Gibson]

Ok I'll try them out. I set the float according to specs. I'm wanting to get me one of those ultra sonic cleaners or whatever they're called

And i checking compression at no throttle and also WOT. Wot was 90.  Don't remember nt. How could it drop 25 psi in s matter off minutes? Itty say up a while so I changed the oil. Before cranking on it i oiled the piston chamber and slowly hand returned the motor

 

[Frank Angerano]

This was a conversation a while back about open and closed throttle during a compression test.  The difference is the amount of air intake into the cylinder to compress. So open throttle allows more air into the head that will give you higher compression. 
Depending on the condition of your piston/rings or a bad head gasket would make a difference on the test.   
 

Blow out all the ports on the carburetor with air and check your float needle that allows fuel to flow into the bowl.   

[Daniel Gibson]

I've tried that about 20 times the last week. Blowing every port in the carb. Each time i run my nozzle cleaners through after soaking in carb dip. 

I'm starting to think it's bad rings. It sat up 5 years i know of. The oil all over the motor was close to an inch or more thick. Every seal on it leaks. Plus the oil was very gassy. Very thin. Muy customer tried to get it going before he brought it. I'm sure he didn't oil cylinder or anything before bringing it to me. He tried starting it with 5 year old gas and he was starting his truck to jump it off. I'm surprised it didn't burn up the cdi. No telling what what else he done to it. 

[Frank Angerano]

I hear ya but these things are hearty. They run forever. Hopefully you got the oil and grease off.  Maybe adjust the float a little higher so your sure the fuel is getting to the bowl.  
Bad rings would not prevent the engine from startup as long as there’s some compression. 
 

 

[spock58]

You shouldn't be getting such inconsistent compression readings. If all else fails, I'd recommend you pull the cylinder head and check the condition of the valves & their seats. Could be some carbon is messing things up. It also would be a good thing to check into the cam chain and its tensioner since you mentioned that it was 3 teeth off - that doesn't happen unless there's a lot of wear involved.

[Daniel Gibson]

To me the cam gear looks fine. They DO NOT make a sharp point. I know on motorcycles and heavy equipment for sure that's a good way to tell. The chain and tensioner appear and feel tight. No excess slack in anything inside the engine. The bike was on a ranch for the last twenty something years almost 30. I'm sure it is gone through many many pairs of hands I'm starting to think that maybe the low compression issue caused the people to check the timing and tried to set it and got it wrong

[spock58]

I dunno but it sounds like compression numbers you're getting are pretty low. Around a hundred a motor will still run but getting it started might be tough - that is the issue, right? Anything that old that's been tortured likely needs rings & possibly valve work to run right.  I'd say it's time to pull the top end apart and see what's needed.

[Frank Angerano]

I will agree with @spock58 with the top end just based on the amount of wear and tear. 
But before all that go ahead and double check the timing, valve adjustment and see what you get.  I would bet you adjust the valves and compression will change.  
Look at the compression release as well to make sure it’s operating properly and if so after a valve adjustment it should fire up. 
If the carburetor is good and it’s getting fuel she will fire up. 

[Daniel Gibson]

Yes starting it has been a big issue. Before it quit this time i would have to cover the carb with my hand to start it. Would run pretty good after it warmed up. Now it won't even try. How exactly does the compression valve work on these? I know on riding mowers it works off the camshaft. Is it possible it's just hanging open a bit and that's where my compression is going?

[Frank Angerano]

The decompression device could  be malfunctioning. There is a set of springs on the cam with two small weights. Sometimes the springs break off.  You also have the lever on the top of the engine that should be checked for proper operation.  

[spock58]

These motors don't have a decompresser built into the cam, there's only an external lever to use manually I believe.

[Frank Angerano]

Could be but mine had the external for pull start purposes and the internal for electric start If i remember  correct but i could  be wrong.  

[Daniel Gibson]

@Frank Angerano @spock58 thanks for the help so far. Ive double checked timing and valve lash several times and both are spot on. I will check out the decompression valve later today. I have a feeling that's what it is. Everything else seems to be fine. Valves are surprisingly clean for it's age. I'll let y'all know what i find out in a bit

[Frank Angerano]

Thats good news. Keep us posted.  

[Frank Angerano]

Just a stupid pointer. Spray the area of where the head gasket is with windex or a soapy solution, make sure the spark plug is in and crank the engine to see if your head gaskets are ok and your not getting bubbles. 

[Daniel Gibson]

Just an update... I have my compression back suddenly. Don't know how as i haven't touched the bike in over a week?!? Oh well lol. Now though i have no spark. What are the notorious things on these bayous that fail?

[Frank Angerano]

Anything damp ? 

[spock58]

Start with the simple stuff: pull apart any connectors you find, check for corrosion, spray WD40 in them, remove plug cap & cut back the wire a bit for starters.

[Frank Angerano]

Def good to do as @spock58 mentioned. Reason I'm asking about damp conditions is my old fourtrax used to lose spark when it was damp. Turned out my cdi outer casing was separating from the epoxy fill and letting moisture in. If it dried out it had spark again.  

[Daniel Gibson]

Nothing is damp. The bike is inside my shop which used to be a guest house. It stays dry. I have jiggled all the wires while hoping on one foot while working upon a star and haven't had any luck. I cleaned the pig tails and every connector,check continuity, grounds are good. I put a little dielectric grease After drying everything with 90 percent alcohol. 

[Frank Angerano]

Ok well i guess its time to start some testing on the stator and usual suspects.  

[Daniel Gibson]

Yeah I'm about to dive back in to it. Kinda lost my motivation with it for a bit. Lol

[Frank Angerano]

I hear ya brother. Get back into it and get after it.