Where is Nuetral Safety Switch 06 Big Bear 400 4wd?

[JonnyBlaze]

On 7/10/2024 at 12:27 AM, Gwbarm said:

Thats it to get to the switch. It under the primary clutch. Just be sure to torque the nuts back on and bend up the tab.

I ordered a new switch and cover gasket. What's the torque specs? They'll be here tomorrow. 

[Gwbarm]

Its around 100 ft pds, let me look it up to be more exact.

[Gwbarm]

Primary clutch 100 ft pds, clutch case bolts 7.2 ft pds. This is from a 2001 big bear 400 manual.

[JonnyBlaze]

3 minutes ago, Gwbarm said:

Primary clutch 100 ft pds, clutch case bolts 7.2 ft pds. This is from a 2001 big bear 400 manual.

Thanks. 

[Mech]

I'd be very cautious about doing that nut up to 100ft.. I'd do it up, despite what the book says, to 65-70.. 

[JonnyBlaze]

Got new switch. If I ground the contact, I believe the smaller one is reverse, can I plug it in a test it before ripping it all apart? 

[Gwbarm]

I agree Mech 100 ft pds is a lot of torque, but that is what the book said.

[Mech]

Yeah I believe you Gw..  Always.  But threads get worn, wrenches get inaccurate and sticky, people don't always use them as they should be used.. And I'm a mechanic, I'm responsible for my work no matter what the books might say, If I strip it it's me buying a new shaft and doing the work for free. 70lb feet will keep that nut tight if it's all assembled right, and if there is something not right in there, 100 isn't going to save it.

 

Anyway.. that switch..  You notice Jonny that that switch has no spung contact to make sure it contacts the shift barrel's contacts.. That means the barrel will have a sprung contact, and a common sort of contact is a plunger and spring in a drilling in the barrel, and those plungers get worn sometimes so they can wobble, and seeing the size of that contact i can see it wouldn't take much wear to cause the problem. Check the plunger real careful for wear..

Edited July 15, 2024 by Mech

[JonnyBlaze]

4 minutes ago, Mech said:

Yeah I believe you Gw..  Always.  But threads get worn, wrenches get inaccurate and sticky, people don't always use them as they should be used.. And I'm a mechanic, I'm responsible for my work no matter what the books might say, If I strip it it's me buying a new shaft and doing the work for free. 70lb feet will keep that nut tight if it's all assembled right, and if there is something not right in there, 100 isn't going to save it.

 

Anyway.. that switch..  You notice Jonny that that switch has no spung contact to make sure it contacts the shift barrel's contacts.. That means the barrel will have a sprung contact, and a common sort of contact is a plunger and spring in a drilling in the barrel, and those plungers get worn sometimes so they can wobble, and seeing the size of that contact i can see it wouldn't take much wear to cause the problem. Check the plunger real careful for wear..

Should I buy a plunger before I start ripping it apart? Wonder if they are available? 

[Mech]

Check in the online parts place to see if it is a plunger, and how much it is.

Babbits have a good diagram based index page..  Partzilla though will tell you what other models and years a part fits, and which parts you may be able to use if your year parts are supposedly unavailable.

[JonnyBlaze]

1 minute ago, Mech said:

Check in the online parts place to see if it is a plunger, and how much it is.

I've looked several sites and don't see anything. 

[Mech]

Yeah I just looked and it's not shown.. Presumably it comes with the shift barrel..

The plungers I've seen have been solid brass or bronze, about three mm diameter, and easy to improvise..  Just saying..

I think they mostly start off with a round/ball end that makes the contact. That would have good pressure and minimise the friction that would lead to the wear and getting bent to the side in the drilling.

[JonnyBlaze]

Ok. I need help! Before I go any further. I have it all apart. New switch is in. Before I put it back together I wanted to see if nuetral light comes on and it does. BUT! The reverse light comes on too! When I loosen the switch bolts a little, the reverse light goes off. Then when I tighten down it comes back on. What now? 

Edited July 15, 2024 by JonnyBlaze

[JonnyBlaze]

Is this arm supposed to have anything to do with making contact on that switch? It's what's making the reverse light stay on. I can rotate the rod and push it in further and install switch and reverse light stays off. 

[Mech]

Is that a little plunger in the end of the shift barrel, or a spring with a cap on it ?

Either way, I'd suspect the flat spot on the end is a contributing factor. A flat lets oil get between it and the switch contact and can make them not always contact. And, the flat, because it has more contact than a ball contact does, gets dragged sideways by the switch plate and contacts, so if there's any play the plunger, it can easily be left in the wrong position by a tiny amount.

If it was mine I'd consider making a new plunger, a plunger as long as was possible while still leaving room for the spring, and a nice close fit in the hole, flat on the spring end and ball ended on the contact end. A fat piece of bronze welding rod does a good job. You can/could put a length in a drill to slim it down with a file wrapped in wet and dry sandpaper.

Ha, and no that lever should not be operating the switch..

[JonnyBlaze]

1 minute ago, Mech said:

Is that a little plunger in the end of the shift barrel, or a spring with a cap on it ?

Either way, I'd suspect the flat spot on the end is a contributing factor. A flat lets oil get between it and the switch contact and can make them not always contact. And, the flat, because it has more contact than a ball contact does, gets dragged sideways by the switch plate and contacts, so if there's any play the plunger, it can easily be left in the wrong position by a tiny amount.

If it was mine I'd consider making a new plunger, a plunger as long as was possible while still leaving room for the spring, and a nice close fit in the hole, flat on the spring end and ball ended on the contact end. A fat piece of bronze welding rod does a good job. You can/could put a length in a drill to slim it down with a file wrapped in wet and dry sandpaper.

The problem I'm having is the the reverse shifter thing I have a yellow arrow pointing to. Where is it supposed to sit????

[Mech]

Yeah I added an answer to that at the end of my post there..

The lever should not be operating the switch.

That lever must need rotating around a bit I'd think, or pulling outwards ..

The manual will explain in the engine disassembly or as part of the reassembly process I'd think.

[JonnyBlaze]

5 minutes ago, Mech said:

Yeah I added an answer to that at the end of my post there..

The lever should not be operating the switch.

That lever must need rotating around a bit I'd think, or pulling outwards ..

The manual will explain in the engine disassembly or as part of the reassembly process I'd think.

When I push that rod in all the way and that lever is away from switch, the nuetral light is on and reverse light off like it should be. So that lever I pointed to should not be behind the switch, correct? 

Unfortunately I don't have a manual and this is all that's hanging me up. 

11 minutes ago, Mech said:

Yeah I added an answer to that at the end of my post there..

The lever should not be operating the switch.

That lever must need rotating around a bit I'd think, or pulling outwards ..

The manual will explain in the engine disassembly or as part of the reassembly process I'd think.

How does the switch know when its in nuetral or reverse? That contact plunger is responsible for both? How does it rotate to make contact if that's the case? 

[Mech]

That round bit with the sprung loaded plunger in it, is generally called a "shift barrel' or "shift drum", and it gets turned by the shift lever to move the "shift forks", which slide the gears in and out of mesh. When it's in neutral the plunger should be contacting the neutral contact and nothing else.

There are service manuals for free download in here..

[JonnyBlaze]

3 minutes ago, Mech said:

That round bit with the sprung loaded plunger in it, is generally called a "shift barrel' or "shift drum", and it gets turned by the shift lever to move the "shift forks", which slide the gears in and out of mesh. When it's in neutral the plunger should be contacting the neutral contact and nothing else.

There are service manuals for free download in here..

So this whole thing turns? Ok. Makes sense. 

I saw the files but says I have to pay to download. 

Edited July 16, 2024 by JonnyBlaze

[JonnyBlaze]

20 minutes ago, Mech said:

That round bit with the sprung loaded plunger in it, is generally called a "shift barrel' or "shift drum", and it gets turned by the shift lever to move the "shift forks", which slide the gears in and out of mesh. When it's in neutral the plunger should be contacting the neutral contact and nothing else.

There are service manuals for free download in here..

Where does the lever rest? Thanks for your help so far. Much appreciated. 

[Mech]

I've never been inside a yamaha quad Jonny. That lever is a part of the reverse interlock I suspect, and it might be that it sits in the right position once the outer cover is on and cables attached.. or something.

You don't have to pay for manuals here if you are a participating member of the community..  You should be able to download. Contact an admin or moderator if you are having trouble. They're super helpful..

 

You didn't tell me if that is a spring loaded plunger.. 

[Gwbarm]

You have been busy, got the clutches off and got it out. The new one works thats great news. The piece that is out of place is the reverse shift shaft assembly, it is spring loaded and rides against the shift drum. This illustration is from a 2001 manual. 

 

[JonnyBlaze]

Just now, Gwbarm said:

You have been busy, got the clutches off and got it out. The new one works thats great news. The piece that is out of place is the reverse shift shaft assembly, it is spring loaded and rides against the shift drum. This illustration is from a 2001 manual. 

 

Thanks. I figured it out last night. I'm going to finish it this afternoon. 

[Mech]

Good work Gw..  Better illustration than I could find..

So it goes against the flat on the shift drum ?

 

[JonnyBlaze]

It's all back together. Haven't fired it up yet. Waiting on Amazon to drop off oil and filter tomorrow. I had it up on ramps on the right side but that wasn't high enough and lost half the oil. Then I ended up knocking over the oil pan and making a mess in my garage. Grrrrrr. Anyway. The nuetral light works now so that's a plus. I'll keep you updated. Thanks again for all the help. 

[Mech]

haha..  It happens to the best of us.

Good progress.

[Gwbarm]

I have also tried jacking it up to keep from loosing the oil and it always just makes a mess, better to just drain the oil in a clean container and pour it back in.

[Mech]

I've been tilting quads, and laying down scramblers, to work in the side covers for decades and have never spilt the oil..  Kicked the oil pan though !!  haha. Come to think of it, I've driven over one once too..  That was messy.

[JonnyBlaze]

Update. Drain plug was stripped. Go figure. Finally got it off with a chisel and hammer. Now have to wait for new one. Won't be here til Saturday. Ugh.