Testing help for coil on 99 bayou 300

[Jeff Comstock]

Ok, so I had no spark issues and foundy coil was bad. Bought a caltric coil, put it on and fired right up...for bout 20 minutes then it backfired once and again, no spark. I put it on my buddies 300 and it runs.  Checked my cdi the same thing, but still no spark. Now I got my old coil and  was ohming it and got reading of .01 on primary and 11.89 from POS to plug ( meter set on 20k ) new coil reads same primary but 12.83. what gives? It tests bad but runs my buddies 300, helllllllpppp

[Frank Angerano]

It may not have anything to do with a stator or any other coil for that matter.  Could be. A short someplace that’s causing this to happen. Check the kill switch for water, a worn harness that’s rubbing against the frame allowing a conductor to Loose it’s outer vinyl and hit the frame, bad or intermittent ignition switch? 

If you still feel it is a coil then maybe check the secondary coil ? Could be getting hot and breaking down. 

The pick up coil was replaced with the stator I’m assuming since they are bundled. 

Your tests included each phase (wires coming from stator) each wire one at a time to ground for continuity? 
And phase to phase was in spec ? 

 

 

[Jeff Comstock]

Ok from bottom up, yeah I got new stator and pickup coil, new cdi, new clatric coil cdi is OEM, pricey but didn't want to take chances, stator and pickup are caltric also and tested fine, ran fine. As for the secondary coil getting hot and messing up, it works cold fine on another 300 but diddly on mine.

I was reading about starter relay supplying some power to the cdi when cranking but, mines been pull start only for quite a while now and no problems. The coil I just replaced started the same buddies 300 but ended up being dead. It's whyi wondered what the specs were.  Contacted caltric but they wanted to know my shipping number and haven't heard from them since I sent em that. 

Are they're coils different where they'd ohm different?

I've checked litteraly every wire in the harness, it's worth the money in electrical tape to rewrap em Just to be sure everything is kosher.

[Frank Angerano]

When the power is turned on does the neutral light come on when in neutral ?

[Jeff Comstock]

Yes, would a bad starter relay keep it off? I work on cars, trucks and tractors like every other day but, motorcycle engine is a whole new world to me and I smart enough to know that.

[Frank Angerano]

Listen, no matter what your capabilities are it’s not rocket science. We have helped so many people that haven’t been able to start a lawnmower and now they are able to do  all sorts of things.  It’s a matter of isolating the problem.  
 

Under the seat you will find two relays. One has two bigger wires on it, one from the battery and one goes to the starter. there is  also a smaller plug on that relay and it sends power to the cdi and everything else.  That’s the start relay, it has a rubber boot around it and a fuse buried in there.
Check that and then start testing each wire for 12 v.  
The second relay is located in the same place and is round, aluminum and has four wires going to it. Green, white and two black if I can remember.    That’s the “starter Circuit” relay.  That’s coming from the neutral safety switch that’s located in the engine cover left side by the shifter. It’s a green and red wire that goes into the engine. All that does is allow the starter circuit to work because the neutral safety switch tells it that the bike is in neutral. So if you have the dash/neutral lights on then that relay should be fine. 

So turn the key on and go to the starter relay and check the fuse and have a tester ready. I’m going to pull the wire diagram and see if we can do some testing and isolate the problem. 

 

[Jeff Comstock]

Sounds like a plan, I'll check now and let you know asap, and thanks for the help. I see your name in oodles of posts so I assume you have mucho experience with quads. Thanks for taking the time to read this and give advice. 

[Frank Angerano]

Ok so I was wrong on the start circuit relay, it’s two blacks one brown and one light green. 

[Frank Angerano]

Ok so here are some important diagrams.   I’ve highlighted some stuff you need to look at.  
What I like to do is print out the main diagram and highlight all the wires with a ruler and different colors so it’s easier to absorb and see where each wire is going.  So study it for a while and get acclimated to the system. Any questions, ask away.  Start with the testing on the parts first to rule out any bad parts INCLUDING the regulator and only use a test light on the regulator test portion.  Everything else you can use a meter.  
Make sure you have the 12v on the white wire coming off the battery and the start relay has power.  Ask as many questions as you need and if you get frustrated walk away for a little while and go have a beer 🍺. Go back at it again later with a clear head.  

 

[Jeff Comstock]

Ok, so I had the key off and got  12 volts on the battery side nothing on starter side and at the plug in( two wires to starter button) trying to crank it I get 11 volts and .08respectively and 12.3 to the starter

[Frank Angerano]

And does the engine crank over ? 

[Frank Angerano]

When you press the start button you should have 12v on the black wire plugged into the start relay there is a black and black and yellow stripe wire.    
You also have a white wire coming from the battery that goes to the ignition switch and comes  out brown. From there it spreads out and goes to the regulator, and a few other places.  

[Jeff Comstock]

Yeah, so it blows out my starter relay robbing spark due to short idea:( it was one in a ten thousand anyways I figure). Thanks for the diagrams that'll be mega helpful, been meaning to buy avlymer manual 

[Frank Angerano]

Ok brother. Good luck and let us know how it works out.  Feel free to ask any questions. 

[Jeff Comstock]

Traced the white power wire to the regulator and all outgoing non-yellow(alternator) wires. My 300 has the 8 wire/ two fat round plugs, one for alternator, one for rectifier.when I checked the harness all where good and subsequent testing showed power levels,(checked against my buddies running 300,) were normal.

[Frank Angerano]

That white should go to the ignition, regulator and an aux set of wires. 

Check that the cdi is getting power also. 

I believe the cdi power wire is yellow/red. 

Ok brother got to hit the hey. Keep at it, check in tomorrow.   

[Jeff Comstock]

Part of my problem is my cen-tech meter don't do ohms at 1 or 10 like they keep referring to, mine does 200, 2000, 20k, 200k and 2000k. Time to get a new meter:(

[Jeff Comstock]

I get  001 ohms on the stator on every wire at 2000 and 1.0 at 200. I'm assuming that taking that down exponentially to 1 on a meter would be .005 ohms, way below spec. Houston we have a problem, bad stator I'm thinking unless exponentially dropping my reading is wrong. I'll let y'all know

[Jeff Comstock]

Ok so I dug out my old analog multimeter that does 1 and 10 and got 485 ohms at the pick up coil, it says 390-590 so it ohms good, not trash like the cheap cdi I bought last year that was broke from the day it was made. The stator gives me wild fluctuations, from 0 to .4 ohms in like a second and only holds steady at 0. Thinking when ol boy put my new pick up coil in he didn't check the stator, I can get one cheap on Amazon from caltric.

[Frank Angerano]

Check each wire from the stator to the ground as well ,with the tester in between. See if it ohms out (continuity) 

Just curious if any of the three wires is shorted.   

I have had good luck with caltric so far.   

[Jeff Comstock]

Reads open on all three, no shorts there

[Frank Angerano]

Ok, I was just curious.  I’m not sold on that stator being bad but go with it and see how it goes.   Meantime I would continue with all other tests just to rule out any other failures.   
Go through everything else so it’s all wrapped up and it’s just a matter of putting the stator in.  I’m particularly curious on the regulator tests.   
 

[spock58]

On 10/29/2019 at 1:45 PM, Jeff Comstock said:

I get  001 ohms on the stator on every wire at 2000 and 1.0 at 200. I'm assuming that taking that down exponentially to 1 on a meter would be .005 ohms, way below spec. Houston we have a problem, bad stator I'm thinking unless exponentially dropping my reading is wrong. I'll let y'all know

I believe that you're reading 1 ohm on your meter here - the number 200 or 2000 ohms is an "up to" figure. If it was on the 20 scale, it would still read 1 ohm but would be more accurate and likely add a decimal & another number. Does this make sense? In other words, if the spec was around 300 ohms, you'd use the 2000 setting to get a proper reading. Really low resistance is difficult to read and usually only is accurate with a digital meter. Hope this helps.

[Jeff Comstock]

Ok, so as I said, my rides been pull start for a while which makes some stuff harder to check but, finally got some spare time to get back to it and decided to take the recoil starter cover off and hook up a drill with a 14mm socket and pulled my spark plug so I could crank it over while testing stuff. 

Here's  what I found out... pulse coil isn't sending a signal to the CDI. Tested the stator and it's putting out 14.89-15.74 each wire ac volts. Ohmed the pickup at 0.43 set on 20k.

So at 10k would that be 215? Or 430?

They're both new from caltric and you can't adjust the air gap it's a set it and go part. Could the magnet on the stator that fires the pulse coil be bad but the stator still produce power? I'm assuming they can since that's a totally different magnet from the field magnet

[Frank Angerano]

That would be 430 and it sounds like it’s within spec.  
how do you know it’s not sending a signal to the cdi ? 

[Jeff Comstock]

Cranked it over using a drill (in reverse) and put my multimeter on DC volts and at about 650 rpm all it read was .01

[Frank Angerano]

That does. It mean it’s not sending a signal.  If it ohms within spec it’s most likely ok. 
have you tested your secondary ignition coils as well as the regulator ?

[Jeff Comstock]

Yep new regulator and coil will fire all day on my buddies 300. Put it on last time I was working on it and let it run for 45 minutes or so to see if when the coil got hot it would mess up, it didn't. Ran fine.

[Frank Angerano]

Ok well so I guess it’s a new pick up coil but I don’t think you can get them separately? 
If that’s the case then maybe order a whole new set up stator and all. I’ve been lucky with caltrec so far so maybe you got a defective one ?  
So if your sure that everything else tested ok including the cdi which you can only test by putting on another bike and it’s good then you have to go with your gut on this.   

[Jeff Comstock]

I've tested and retested everything from the wiring harness (3 times, OMG what a time consuming pain), put every part except stator and pulse coil on my buddies running 300 so it's either Gremlins or the pick-up coil. Almost worth the oil and gaskets to try that.So can a stator be putting out power yet not activate the pick-up coil? Is that possible? If it's wierd it'll happen to me, true story.

Edited November 8, 2019 by Jeff Comstock
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