Suzuki king quad 300 idles great but Boggs when you apply throttle

[JustRandy]

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

I have never had any problem with the valves in the ten regular customers bikes or the two I have had..

It's important to get them set right, and then they stay set for years.

Once the valve starts wearing, they will not stay set.  So setting them right is a waste of time.  A worn valve will eat up .001 in 5 minutes.  Anyway he said he didn't have feeler gauges.

Evidently you've never seen a worn intake valve like the picture I posted or you'd know all this already.

[97kingquad]

5 minutes ago, JustRandy said:

No you can just take the head off.  I'd get a service manual since it's your first time.  I think they're on here for free.  And get a piece of cardboard and punch holes in it so you can put the bolts in the holes so you can get them back where they came from.

The right thing to do is take the head to a shop and have them cut the seat.  Then order a Vesrah valve that's made in Japan.  I don't trust the metal from China.

The smartest people are those who are quickest to admit they're wrong.  They will be right eventually.

I could see someone backing the valve screw out to get it running and putting it up for sale.

Vice grips.  Big ones.

How the heck?!?I

I broke the ratchet trying to get one of the damn lugs off the tire so I could swap it lol it was a cheap mastercraft I'm gonna get a better set eventually but for now I just buy what I need, Im a carpenter by trade so I have a decent assortment of tools to do what I need. For most jobs just not much for mechanics work 

I guess my hand tools are gonna have to get upgraded I'm gonna tell my girlfriend you guys said I needed them though lol she thinks I have more than enough tools 

[Mech]

Koken sockets are the best quality for the money..

I've been overhauling jap bike engines since 1973 Randy, and done dozens of them, as a profession. I've seen plenty of damage.

[97kingquad]

13 minutes ago, JustRandy said:

The right thing to do is take the head to a shop and have them cut the seat.  Then order a Vesrah valve that's made in Japan.  I don't trust the metal from China

I may just do that, I have to get into the intake valve to check it out first. And I also want to get some feeler gauges as well so I can make sure they are set properly and if that doesn't fix the issue I will take the head off to get the valves replaced. If I have to spend a grand or so getting the bike running for 20 or more years I will. It's a fun bike and they're fairly easy to work on lol

[Mech]

You don't need feeler gauges to set the tappets 97, and it's best not to use them.

Valves get a pit in the end where the rocker presses and the feelers span the pit and give a wrong reading.

You can do it by ear and feel, or by winding the screw in till it touches and then out by the amount that will give the correct clearance.

[JustRandy]

2 minutes ago, 97kingquad said:

I may just do that, I have to get into the intake valve to check it out first. And I also want to get some feeler gauges as well so I can make sure they are set properly and if that doesn't fix the issue I will take the head off to get the valves replaced. If I have to spend a grand or so getting the bike running for 20 or more years I will. It's a fun bike and they're fairly easy to work on lol

Setting them to spec is only important for getting all your cam duration.  When I had a bad valve I'd have to stop on the side of the trail and back the screw out a turn then get going again.  I made the gap huge so I didn't have to do it again for a while.  It ran fine with only small loses in power in the upper rpms.  I pulled many loads of dirt like that until I got time to tear it apart and replace the valve.

But if you're sure you have a gap now and that didn't fix the problem then something else is wrong.

Yep it's a fun quad and I wouldn't trade mine for anything.

[97kingquad]

7 minutes ago, JustRandy said:

Setting them to spec is only important for getting all your cam duration.  When I had a bad valve I'd have to stop on the side of the trail and back the screw out a turn then get going again.  I made the gap huge so I didn't have to do it again for a while.  It ran fine with only small loses in power in the upper rpms.  I pulled many loads of dirt like that until I got time to tear it apart and replace the valve.

But if you're sure you have a gap now and that didn't fix the problem then something else is wrong.

Yep it's a fun quad and I wouldn't trade mine for anything.

I have left the bike for the night I've been on it for four hours but I'm going to get the intake cap off tomorrow and we will see if opening it up a bit helps 

17 minutes ago, Mech said:

You don't need feeler gauges to set the tappets 97, and it's best not to use them.

Valves get a pit in the end where the rocker presses and the feelers span the pit and give a wrong reading.

You can do it by ear and feel, or by winding the screw in till it touches and then out by the amount that will give the correct clearance.

So a feeler gauge would be more useful just checking the valves for wear or setting them new but it is better to go by ear when adjusting them?

[JustRandy]

30 minutes ago, Mech said:

I've been overhauling jap bike engines since 1973 Randy, and done dozens of them, as a profession. I've seen plenty of damage.

Anyone can claim anything online.  But I don't see how anyone could work on engines for 50 years and not know a worn valve won't hold a setting.

It's usually the guys bragging about how much they know who don't know much.  I wonder how you have lived so long and not have learned that too.

You're a mystery, Mech.

Edited July 26, 2023 by JustRandy

[JustRandy]

6 minutes ago, 97kingquad said:

I have left the bike for the night I've been on it for four hours but I'm going to get the intake cap off tomorrow and we will see if opening it up a bit helps 

  Wait a minute.... you haven't even gotten the cap off the check the valve?  It didn't click in my head until now lol

5 minutes ago, 97kingquad said:

So a feeler gauge would be more useful just checking the valves for wear or setting them new but it is better to go by ear when adjusting them?

I agree with Mech there.  I don't use feelers either but I know what .001 feels like.  It's the faintest clicking noise you can possibly make.  .003 is a lot louder.

Basically .001 is the smallest gap you can make and still have a gap.

[Gwbarm]

If you havent adjusted the valves yet, what did you turn to make it worse.

[Mech]

The exhaust valve.

[Gwbarm]

Thanks! I must have missed something, i thought we were working on intake.

[JustRandy]

19 minutes ago, Gwbarm said:

Thanks! I must have missed something, i thought we were working on intake.

Don't feel bad I missed it too.  There's too much going on in this thread lol

People crank those caps on too tight.  They think because it's big it needs torqued down.  Same with oil plugs.

Luckily they don't cost much.

[JustRandy]

I think this is the fuel pump:

A valve inside the pump:

And the petcock

[Mech]

Yup that's a fuel pump, and tap.

[JustRandy]

5 minutes ago, Mech said:

Yup that's a fuel pump, and tap.

Not just a, but the.

And notice the corrosion.  So it's probably worth taking the pump apart for a cleanup anyway.

[Mech]

What ? Because you have a pump with a bit of corrosion in it, everyone should take theirs apart ?

Do you think a dirty pump is the trouble here.  Shouldn't we wait till he's pulled the head off and spent a lot of money getting new valves for that before ripping into anything else ?

Or do you know that all suzuki pumps are crap and cause a lot of problems, always ?

And I suppose there's a particular aftermarket you have fitted that's what everyone should use too.

Really Randy.. We're meant to be helping the guy, not sabotaging his whole bike.

[Mech]

He started off with a simple problem, and all we need to do is figure whether it's fuel or spark, then go from there..

[JustRandy]

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

What ? Because you have a pump with a bit of corrosion in it, everyone should take theirs apart ?

It was an olive branch. man.  You suspected a torn diaphragm in the pump so coupled with possible corrosion I figured I'd back you in your interest in the pump.  But you're so determined to be a miserable turd it's impossible to get along with you.

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

Do you think a dirty pump is the trouble here.

No.  I never thought the pump was the problem.

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

Shouldn't we wait till he's pulled the head off and spent a lot of money getting new valves for that before ripping into anything else ?

If he has a bad valve then what do you recommend?

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

Or do you know that all suzuki pumps are crap and cause a lot of problems, always ?

No they never cause problems that I know of.

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

And I suppose there's a particular aftermarket you have fitted that's what everyone should use too.

I have the one in the picture.  But cleaned up.

12 minutes ago, Mech said:

Really Randy.. We're meant to be helping the guy, not sabotaging his whole bike.

Wish you'd stop sabotaging the thread.

10 minutes ago, Mech said:

He started off with a simple problem, and all we need to do is figure whether it's fuel or spark, then go from there..

What if it's mechanical?

[97kingquad]

8 hours ago, Gwbarm said:

If you havent adjusted the valves yet, what did you turn to make it worse.

Exhaust valve 

[97kingquad]

5 hours ago, JustRandy said:

It was an olive branch. man.  You suspected a torn diaphragm in the pump so coupled with possible corrosion I figured I'd back you in your interest in the pump.  But you're so determined to be a miserable turd it's impossible to get along with you.

No.  I never thought the pump was the problem.

If he has a bad valve then what do you recommend?

No they never cause problems that I know of.

I have the one in the picture.  But cleaned up.

Wish you'd stop sabotaging the thread.

What if it's mechanical?

Just so you guys know, I'm taking everyone into consideration but I'm not going to dig into things that I don't want to at the end of the day. 

Whether one person or everyone thinks a pump or the valves or whatever is the issue. I'll check it out. 

But I'd appreciate it if this didn't turn into who knows more. I'd rather people be able to follow the thread and hopefully fix their issues as well

[kp3004x4]

Ok see if the air box inlet is clogged up or the filter is there should be and inlet that lets air to air filter behind air filter I have seen this problem many a times. Kids run em in mud then mud clogs air inlet a bit  if when you take the air cover off it runs then you need more air for carburetor to do its job. Try running it without air filter.  Maybe bad also. Carbs need the correct air fuel ratio to run.  And it kinda looks this way.  And mech don't let this fellow get under your skin. Sounds like he's reading from a book anyhow. Takes experience and it doesn't show.  Y'all be safe.

[97kingquad]

2 hours ago, kp3004x4 said:

Ok see if the air box inlet is clogged up or the filter is there should be and inlet that lets air to air filter behind air filter I have seen this problem many a times. Kids run em in mud then mud clogs air inlet a bit  if when you take the air cover off it runs then you need more air for carburetor to do its job. Try running it without air filter.  Maybe bad also. Carbs need the correct air fuel ratio to run.  And it kinda looks this way.  And mech don't let this fellow get under your skin. Sounds like he's reading from a book anyhow. Takes experience and it doesn't show.  Y'all be safe.

The air filter is brand new. The airbox seems fine but I may end up pulling it out and trying to get at the screens 

[JustRandy]

5 hours ago, 97kingquad said:

But I'd appreciate it if this didn't turn into who knows more. I'd rather people be able to follow the thread and hopefully fix their issues as well

Me too but he's so jealous someone may know something that he doesn't he always derails the thread from the topic to attacks.  Every single thread I've been on he's claiming he knows it all because he's old.  Usually I just leave.

The only reason I'm here is a year ago he fought with me about regulators and now he's telling people to turn the lights on to see if the engine runs better.  I thought it was hilarious.  Should have just giggled and left.

But if the flow of the thread is what's important then that's not going to happen unless I leave.

4 hours ago, kp3004x4 said:

And mech don't let this fellow get under your skin. Sounds like he's reading from a book anyhow. Takes experience and it doesn't show.  Y'all be safe.

Who would have thought a liberal from New Zealand who thinks everyone should wear their masks and get their vaccines would be such a big hit in MAGA land.  But I'll leave y'all to him.

[97kingquad]

10 minutes ago, JustRandy said:

Me too but he's so jealous someone may know something that he doesn't he always derails the thread from the topic to attacks.  Every single thread I've been on he's claiming he knows it all because he's old.  Usually I just leave.

The only reason I'm here is a year ago he fought with me about regulators and now he's telling people to turn the lights on to see if the engine runs better.  I thought it was hilarious.  Should have just giggled and left.

But if the flow of the thread is what's important then that's not going to happen unless I leave.

Who would have thought a liberal from New Zealand who thinks everyone should wear their masks and get their vaccines would be such a big hit in MAGA land.  But I'll leave y'all to him.

I am not looking to pick sides guys. I just need anyone who may have some information I can use to help 

 

[kp3004x4]

You shouldn't pick sides just you know what you have no one else does. I myself don't care what people think I know me you know you they know them. But I have over 30 years of mechanical so doesn't matter. Just learning what you find out yourself is the better answer to all. I myself have come across allot of crap and people that always knows best but.  You need to do you. Drs say I might eventually die.  I'm only on here to help out since my body's giving up.  Hope for the best for all . ✌️ I myself still learning!

[JustRandy]

There are already 1000s of threads about this that no one reads.  Some I participated in as far back as 2007.  Help is everywhere.  I have over 5000 posts of help on the longest thread on atv connection.  They made a sticky of it  https://atvconnection.com/forums/suzuki/

I have no incentive to do this and certainly no incentive to fight with narcissists while mods not do their job of moderating situations to prevent fights.

I'll just go ride what I'm sure is the most powerful and modded 300 king quad on the planet while you guys concentrate on on decorum.

[Mech]

That's a big call Randy, but then so's 11,000 rpm.

There's a few things I don't like, like bullying(not saying Randy is), and lying(not saying Randy is), and bad dangerous advice; I oppose them wherever I see them.

97 take a look at #41 and #47. Try those things. That will eliminate stuff real simple and cost you nothing.

You can check your valves are sealing properly by pulling on the pull start. It will come up fairly solid if everything's fine. If you can pull it over let us know and we can tell you how to diagnose what's wrong there.

You should avoid adjusting the valves because those things are quite prone to self adjusting, and if you follow Randy's advice you will have the same problems he says he has so much experience of. If they are adjusted correctly, they don't give problems for years and years..literally.

[JustRandy]

You need to tell suzuki they are wrong

 

Just like you need to tell the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers and manufacturers of lithium batteries that they are wrong about how to charge lithium batteries.

Just like you need to tell John Deere and cutting edge modern mechanics that lapping valves is perfectly ok.

Amazing that the best and brightest engineers are always wrong while some old fart from New Zealand has a monopoly on knowledge.

Talk about dangerous advice.... I wouldn't consider anything true unless Mech disagreed.  The guy you advised to lap valves is 100% for sure going to have to replace his valves within a year.  The guy with a bad regulator you would have had him buying new cdi and random electrical parts if I didn't convince him to try the regulator.  Who knows what you'll do to 97.  But if he doesn't have enough sense to believe Suzuki over you then he deserves what he gets.

[97kingquad]

2 hours ago, JustRandy said:

There are already 1000s of threads about this that no one reads.  Some I participated in as far back as 2007.  Help is everywhere.  I have over 5000 posts of help on the longest thread on atv connection.  They made a sticky of it  https://atvconnection.com/forums/suzuki/

I have no incentive to do this and certainly no incentive to fight with narcissists while mods not do their job of moderating situations to prevent fights.

I'll just go ride what I'm sure is the most powerful and modded 300 king quad on the planet while you guys concentrate on on decorum.

So you got butt hurt and rather than being informative (or continuing to help me) you are blaming everyone else? 

Bobandy you have just as much or little say as anyone else does here. I have not overlooked anyone's comments on this thread but if you get upset because you feel you're being challenged by someone else's knowledge maybe you're not as confident in it as they are?

4 minutes ago, JustRandy said:

You need to tell suzuki they are wrong

 

Just like you need to tell the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers and manufacturers of lithium batteries that they are wrong about how to charge lithium batteries.

Just like you need to tell John Deere and cutting edge modern mechanics that lapping valves is perfectly ok.

Amazing that the best and brightest engineers are always wrong while some old fart from New Zealand has a monopoly on knowledge.

Talk about dangerous advice.... I wouldn't consider anything true unless Mech disagreed.  The guy you advised to lap valves is 100% for sure going to have to replace his valves within a year.  The guy with a bad regulator you would have had him buying new cdi and random electrical parts if I didn't convince him to try the regulator.  Who knows what you'll do to 97.  But if he doesn't have enough sense to believe Suzuki over you then he deserves what he gets.

Lol who pooped in your cornflakes randels